Summit 17 minutes

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Summit 17

Day 1


Summary - Revert sentinel

MattJ - MAM doesn't provide history sync, but it's in the requirements

Kev - MAM needs push, overlaps with Carbons

MattJ - Consensus was it's too late, carbons is there.

Ralph - PubSub message structure - Twitter bot sent message/atom:stuff - Simplify, less wrapper elements(?) - event and payload as siblings instead of event/payload

Kev doesn't want MAM to be pubsub - Session is - fetch since last disconnect - send messages - disconnect - goto 1

CSI would pause a MAM subscription

MattJ - Things get complicated with varying support for 198, MAM, Carbons - MAM replaces Offline messages? - Persistent Client ID, "MAM Cookie" - Server can know which messages are sent

Ralph - Presence doesn't have IDs? - Presence in MAM?

Kev - You want to forget everything and re-fetch MAM - Almost ready to say Carbons should echo your message

MattJ - Lets just do the echo

MattJ - We're not modifying core routing rules

Ralph - MAM, Carbons not best friends with E2E

MattJ - Not all messages are archived, like IBB - Just do echo

Stanzas that go in MAM archive and are Carboned are not the same

Kev wants most of IMAP MattJ - No!

Kev - Echo is the simplest

So echos with MAM MAM-supporting server needs to replace (archived)

Steffan Larsen - Are AMP and MAM compatible? - Expire pubsub notifications -

ACTION: MAM: Remove sentinel. Add back archived Carbons: echo sent messages, include arhived

Kev - Multi client - Delivered messages, flags, delivery vs read receipts - Chat markers in MAM? - PubSub node with 'I read up to here' pointers

IDs, UIDs, local, global??? Server assigns UIDs to messages (in the server)

Kev - Clients wants to know how much was buffered by CSI - Don't notify about old buffered messages - Response to CSI?

MattJ - 198 and general network lag has tihs issue - Changing CSI doesn't solve it


PEP things

Sergey presented

Account model

Dave presented

Clients directing the Account to do things. In MUC and PEP the Client does things to remote nodes.


Was this a general discussion?

Non-presence based MUC where the Account connects to the room.

  • Add Account to room roster
  • Room Roster
  • Share presence

Keep concept of occupant jid Clean multiple joins Fixes Carbons and MAM issues

Presence-less MUC

"Cookie monster" (name?) presents

Discussion went on to create MUC 2


Dave wants a Historic XEP documenting current OTR


  • XEP-0060 got cut in pieces in preparation for splitting.
  • More discussions about MUC 2.

Day 2

Discussions in smaller groups about various things.